Experimenting with Initiative Styles

initiative
#1

I’ve been experimenting with different ways of running initiative and combat encounters in both live tables and VTTs. I’m not sure which I prefer the most… probably Popcorn for a real table, but I’ve yet to find one I prefer in VTT. What have you tried that you like?

  • Rolled order Everyone PC and NPC rolls for initiative then turns are taken in descending order. Y’all know this one and I thin kit’s the most common because of just that… everyone is familiar with it. But whether a real table or VTT it’s easy for a player to check out while just waiting for their turn.
  • Popcorn One person goes then calls out who in the party goes next. WHen the players are finished. the baddies then take their shot. At an actual table this really seems to shine, players like the agency while finding symmetry with each other. Plus everyone stays engaged because “I may be next.” I’ve read of a variation on this where,say, the target is 12 and the player doesn’t hit the target by 1 or 2 so the GM offers a “push” to the player to make it a success, but then the turn order must switch to the GM side of the table. I’ve not had it work as well on VTT because I think it can be challenging to feel that “groupiness” in a VTT, especially in pick-up games.
  • Round the table All the PCs and NPCs roll and whoever is highest starts out with subsequent actions taken by the person to their left and so it goes around the table. I like this better than rolled order but it has the same drawback of people checking out.
  • GM narrative That’s what I’m calling this one. Based on the fiction the GM decides who goes first and then, based on in-game action, turns the spotlight on the PC who most makes sense to go next (Jonesy, you see the Orc pin Beloc to the wall with a sword and it’s just about to gut him, but just a few feet away is another Orc coming at you. What are you doing?). There’s no stop in the flow of the game, you’re just walking along and shit happens with no pausing to roll for initiative. I like this one as it feels more immersive, furthers the fiction and is more dynamic - especially if you have players who just “I attack” - however it runs the risk of GM running his mouth too much and I question if there’s a loss of agency here… ?
#2

I’ve done it with cards both in person and on vtt, although the cards were still physical. Basically just cut a bunch of index cards in half and write the characters, enemies, environment, etc on each card then shuffle and draw. Round is over when everyone has gone. Shuffle and start the next round. If someone has multiple attacks/ actions then they get a card for each.
It’s pretty fun and dynamic, and definitely keeps folk’s attention, hehe.

#3

I like that… additional actions may come later in initiative order.

#4

The problem with Initiative is that, as with all aspects of RPGs, the more realism you inject into the game, the slower game play is likely to be. Abstraction tends to be faster. Now, if your goal is more combat simulation than storyplay, then perhaps more realism is exactly what you want.

I tend to prefer a single Initiative roll, or alternatively a static initiative based upon a unit’s agility or speed stat, with appropriate modifiers, at the beginning of combat, and then action by turn afterward.

The only problem with this is handling multiple attacks by one unit in a single turn, particularly in systems like D&D, where a mid level character can have as many as 5 or even 7 attacks per turn (like an 11th level Fighter/Champion with Two-Handed Fighting and Action Surge) because it really doesn’t seem sporting to allow a PC to hit an enemy 7 times without the enemy having a chance to get a lick in.

#5

Rolled individual order is probably my least favorite style.

Randomized side based initiative is probably my favorite, once you drop old school trappings of specific action orders (like missiles before movement, etc). I think it adds a bit of random danger to what happens. I have players bounce off it when they can’t improve their initiative sometimes though.

I do love the ICRPG, always in turns, just go around the table initiative style.

An initiative order I have not tried yet but I am dying to bring to the table is the stack from Troika! You put tokens into a draw bag, and pull randomly. Players normally get two tokens, and enemies get a number of tokens based on their abilities. There’s a round end token where everything resets. In theory, it’s pure chaos. You might go twice and then the round ends and then the enemies all go and the round ends etc. Troika! is high on my list to get to the table.

#6

The simple solution is d6 roll. 1-3 enemy goes first and 4-6 PCs go first. Then you do it again every round.

What also really works well is static initiative based on Dex and whatever bonus they may have. This is always static and players go first on ties.

The only reason this order will change to enemy favor or not being allowed to roll group initiative is because the enemy caught the players by surprise via ambush (if both parties are surprised, no one is).

#7

One of the most Fun and creative Initiative sequence controls is presented by “Dragonbane”.
Use Playing cards. Higher card goes first. Everyone draws a card…including the GM…Multiple if he has different opponents or groups. Face Down. Then everyone flips cards. This adds fun and excitement(in my humble opinion), creating a game within the game.
The key to me that makes this interesting is that CARDS CAN BE SWAPPED! If the player with the best card (high or low value depending which direction the group or GM decides will determine sequence) wishes to do so…they may SWAP sequence position! This creates engagement= The players discuss who would be more effective going first and can make tactical decisions= Would It be better for the magic user to throw his fireball at the goblins before the fighters rush up and attack them? Would it be better to let the goblins go first to see where they go, and it will be easier to decide the best way to attack them as a result? Maybe one of the players has an item or trick that would improve their situation if they go before the player who has the “BETTER” card…just Swap!
One could even SWAP a player turn for a Monster! It makes situations more lively and tactically engaging…because it increases PLAYER AGENCY. You can go when YOU want…not what dice rolls …OR pre assigned table sequence (Clockwise or Counter-Clockwise) DICTATE.
Any time a PLAYER has choice they feel better. Players with skills or items that normally allow them to go first could perhaps be allowed 2 cards and could choose the better of the 2…thus granting “Advantage” on initiative…especially on “SURPRISE” rounds! I advise folks to try this for an evening. Using cards does not initially seem to make much difference…HOWEVER…once you have played this way…ESPECIALLY with the SWAP Mechanic…WOW! TRY IT!!!

#8

I’m pondering on running the “no initative” style of Professor Dungeon Master. Everyone says what they want to do, including the monsters, then everyone rolls their dice at the same time and the DM sorts out who hit and missed.

#9

For ICRPG I generally run the “Round the Table” with “Monsters in the Middle” and “Damage at the End”.

So like it says I start with the player to my left and go in boardgame order around the table, but based on how many foes, groups of foes, or number of Foe Actions I break those up and insert them between the player turns. All damage is noted when it happens but is applied at the end of the round. This means anyone, friend or foe, who was standing at the beginning of the round acts in the round and takes damage at the end of the round.

I have a more full description of this in another post on this topic,

I am also a fan of the World of Darkness Stack Style Initiative (First in Last Out)
Works like this, The slowest character initiative declares their actions first, they are locked in and the GM notes what they are doing then, the next slowest all the way to the fastest. What this simulates is the faster characters are able to, see what others are doing and react to what is happening, the GM then narrates what happens in reverse order of the declarations starting with the fastest player and then moving down the line to the slowest.

#10

I’d seen a video recently from, i think, Bob the World Builder doing similar… Bigger monsters in the middle with minions at the end, or All Monsters go on 12.

#11

This is my go-to method. It’s super quick and not much to track.

That resolves my issue with most initiative methods. The whole game pauses at a high tension moment while everyone breaks narrative to roll dice or cards or draws colored pebbles or whatever, then the GM sifts through and orders the results, then back to game. Most initiative is a buzzkill in my opinion.

The challenge is that combat is chaotic so its difficult to apply order to while maintaining the sense of chaos.

#12

This I’ve really been meaning to try. My challenge would be remembering what the hell all my enemies are going to do.

#13

This is a good method when there is trust in the Players and the GM. If you err on the side of the players, then you should be good to go.

The easiest way to handle what everyone is doing is to have them write it down in a chat or on an index card. They can write the general action and who the target is, something like:

  • Melee attack
  • range attack
  • attack magic
  • support magic
  • movement action
  • trick
  • rogue action
  • Miscellaneous Action

And then choose targets based on:

  • nearest target
  • most dangerous target
  • weakest target
  • most injured ally
  • key location

Everyone rolls together! Then GM can determine who does what first when it matters (if there is simultaneous attacks to see if one side is killed before they can deliver their attack). No takebacks! The choices are solidly made and if the target is no longer available due to range or being out of combat, then that’s a wasted turn! Go AGAIN.