Using timer die for social encounters

#1

tl;dr skip to last paragraph

I recently ran my first game session of ICRPG. After following the youtube videos and having purchased it back when the version 1 books first became available I was thrilled. Had a great time with it. As i stare down my second session there is one thing that I wanted to focus on that I feel didn’t go well in my first session: Using the timer die in social encounters.

In session 1: I began with a social encounter using a steward character who was in charge of screening those that would have audience with the king. My goal was to have the players introduce themselves and start off slow with a non-combat scene to get the rules of taking turns and passing the spotlight, introduce the timer die and the room DC, etc. One of my players played nicely with the NPC and one didn’t, cool! Variance, different character relations to RP with. I ran into problems though because I had rolled a 3 or 4 on the timer die but it seemed like my players were bored with the NPC after 2 rounds. I skipped ahead and onto the next scene, because I didn’t want anyone to be bored.

Planning for session 2: I am having my characters chase some raiders through the sewers. The raiders have stolen the princess. I plan to have them encounter a shopkeeper who saw which way the raiders went (treat). He won’t tell the players which way until they spend some money first (threat I guess). And he doesn’t want to be seen selling to my players because up until recently the raiders were his best customers (timer). My worry though is that I’ll roll a high timer and the players will be done with the encounter in a turn or two. Or I will roll a lower timer and the players will not be done with the encounter when the timer is up.

How do you use a timer die for social encounters? If the timer die is just how long before the NPC leaves or gets belligerent, how do you make sure the players can accomplish the task without just handing it to them? If the timer die is to have certain events in the discussion happen, how do you ensure that interesting things are happening up to that point, even if the timer die roll is high?

#2

Consider that your timer die doesn’t _have_to be random. If you think there’s a sweet spot for number of rounds (such as the interaction you mentioned with the merchant), make it so.

Let’s say the you feel the right number is 2 rounds. Have it be that and you don’t even need to let your players know. RP the Merchant as being stressed and seemingly in a hurry (he doesn’t want to be spotted by the Raiders). After the first round have the merchant escalate his urgency by pressuring the PCs to hurry and commit to a purchase to receive the info. If they don’t pick up on it within the second round, have the merchant bail on them or maybe some raiders catch them in the act and off the merchant.

For me a timer die doesn’t always have to be random. I would use it only when I want time to be randomized. There are plenty of times as GM you may feel a certain timing in rounds for something is right. If so, just do it.

#3

I’m not certain you even need to roll a timer for a social encounter. If your players are good at getting information out of NPCs and not wasting time, then I don’t think you need the time pressure that a timer provides.

If the NPC is going to flee or attack or something, then maybe you might add a timer, but I’m not sure you need one. But if you do have a timer, as @Wildstar indicated, you can totally control a timer. Just set it to how many rounds you think will work. Or frankly, just have events happen depending on how your players roll or RP with the NPC. If they catch him lying, he just runs (no timer needed). Or just plan that ninjas show up as soon as the NPC mentions Rosebud. Or whatever. Variety is the spice of life, after all.

#4

Keep in mind that you in no way have to wait for the timer to run out. If they complete a room before the timer runs down, they just move on right? You don’t wait for the timer. Same with social encounters. If they have 1d4 rounds until the merchant grows annoyed, but they get everything they need before that, great! They get to maintain a positive relationship and move on. It sounds like you made the right call by skipping ahead and there is no reason to view that as a failure.

If you do just want to add more tension though here are my thoughts:

Timers can be turns instead of rounds. Maybe if you roll a 4 only four players get a chance to speak before the thing happens. In this case, I would let players pass and not reduce the timer when they do.

Remember you can also use effort in social encounters. It might take a heart or two of effort to persuade an NPC or pry a secret out of them.

The timer doesn’t need to be the end of the social encounter. Just like in a dungeon room the timer running out is rarely instant death. Here are some other possibilities:

  • “If you want any more info you’re going to need to grease the pot, I’ve already told you enough for what you paid”
  • Another character walks by. Maybe law enforcement or a nosy courtier. All players need to make deception checks to quickly change the conversation without looking suspicious until they pass.
  • As the NPC grows agitated, rather than ending the conversation the room target increases.

Finally, remember that you don’t always need a timer. They’re great, they’re not mandatory 100% of the time.

#5

Really great advice, here.

#6

Allow me to reinforce this: If a single check will do, never bother with effort and therefore time.

#7

I’ve only run two sessions now, and in both cases I’ve run into moments when there was no obvious timer called for. I remembered Hankerin’s advice to always have a timer going, and I felt stuck. So I’m a little confused where the line is between having a timer and not having one.

I definitely hear the advice to just pick a number for the timer, though. In my next session some baddies are going to take some hostages and give the PCs to the count of three to surrender.

#8

I have only run one session so far, but I watched a ton of Hankerin’s sessions on YouTube. I can defiantly say that he doesn’t always have a timer running (most of the time, but not always). I could be wrong, but I think when he says there should always be a timer going, I don’t think he necessarily means a timer die. I think he means that things should always be progressing. So, If the action is moving things along, or there is enough other pressure, you can hold off on starting the next timer die.

#9

Thanks to all, really good ideas here. I think for my shopkeeper encounter I will try and incorporate a heart of effort. I like this idea for him not wanting to tell the PCs the info. It gives some system support to them prying the info out of him either with a social roll or by purchasing stuff. Buy a thing? Roll effort too! Sounds fun.

And increasing the room DC sounds like an easy way to give weight to the timer without having the NPC storm off. I guess I need to remember I can change that during the game, it doesn’t have to be a static number.

#10

You can also use the timer for a beneficial effect. For example: in that first session you could make it a one heart challenge by adding the timer (the audience begins) and letting them roll effort for their socializing. If they make it, the NPC accidentally slips out a secret about the king, that reduces the room DC to easy if they use it. (For example: the king really bonds around cats, so if you bring cats up in your plea, he is easier to sway).

For session 2 I would say that the threat is that he gives them the wrong information. The timer could be that he has some raiders coming by to seal a large deal (maybe transporting the princess away?) and he wants the PCs to go away. If they make the one or two heart(s) of effort he will point them towards a place where they can listen to the deal or spring a trap to kill the raiders.

Just some ideas, it’s your game, I hope it works out :slight_smile:

#11

To add pressure you can also have the NPC “heal” effort made to persuade them. Either on the GM turn or when the players fail a CHA check. And then maybe if he heals more than they damage he does get irate and sends them off. You do need a consequence otherwise if they can take as long as they want the encounter is boring. Like being able to poke a monster to death with arrows who can’t reach you. It’s boring.