Dont like room single difficulty rule


#1

so i watched the video about icrpg. I loved everything but 1 thing. The idea that difficulty applies to the whole room and the dm shows it on a large d20. I think this seems weird and less like real-life role-playing. like what if in the room there is one big boss and he has 5 small henchmen. I don’t think they should all have the same ac. Am i understanding this right?

if i am understanding this right does anyone have ideas to mod this? has anyone else modified this rule? if so how did it turn out?


#2

You can use the easy/hard modifiers to vary difficulty within a room

Or just use the 5e style DC per thing system


#3

A single target number for a room encompasses the entire difficulty of the room: fighting a boss with five henchman; the terrain; the lighting; disruptions or environmental factors (lava rising, gusting wind, unstable floor); and other challenges (locks that need picked, etc.).

There are a couple of advantages to a single target on display: For the players, it speeds up play considerably, as everyone knows exactly what he or she needs to succeed at any moment. For the DM, it vastly speeds up prep, as you don’t need to put a target or DC on every single one of those things when getting ready for play.

Those of us who made the switch love it, and so I’d humbly invite you to try it and see if it doesn’t help your table. But, if you don’t like it, then don’t use it. Just come up with a ton of little target numbers for everything in your room. Lol.


#4

Or this. The boss is Hard. All the tasks in the room are normal. And the henchmen are Easy. Or some variant.


#5

A unified TN is not just what you roll to hit monsters. It represents the tension in the room/encounter and how hard doing stuff effectively is for the party.

Ambushing a sleeping dragon might set a TN of 12, but as soon as it wakes up in fury, that TN could escalate to 16+, representing the chaos of the moment and the flames going everywhere.

Imho it is something that makes a lot of sense in the fiction.

If you don’t like it tho, you can always use (like others have said) 5e like variable DCs. Just ad AC to monsters it’ll do it.


#6

The room target isn’t really meant to represent just AC. In fact, the room target works best when you contextualize it as something mostly immutable, like the environment, or as a function of the narrative. It’s not meant to simulate real-life, it’s more a way to easily control tension and catharsis in your game. A target of 12 is fairly simple, and allows players to breath a sigh of relief, while a target of 16 might be too high to handle, and signals that maybe that a change in plans should be considered.

Making monsters distinct comes down to 2 things: their abilities, and their decisions. How hard they are to hit isn’t as important as if they can cast a big AoE spell, or heal themselves. If you have a boss NPC with a handful of henchmen, then you make them distinct through other, more nuanced mechanics. Maybe the boss reduces all damage taken by 3, making them much tougher. Maybe the henchmen only have 1 hit point, so they can be taken out en masse. If you’re a patron, I might recommend the podcast on Monster Sets, where Hanks talks about making enemies distinct through their mechanics, and how they can inter-relate to each other.


#7

This is exactly what I do in odd rooms. The Lich and magical traps in her lair is TN 16. The summoned skeletons are Easy however, and so on.

BTW- you’re free to never use the room TN as well. If you don’t like it, leave the standard AC/Difficulty rules. It’s your game.


#8

ok so let see if i get it. so you are setting like the base tension of the room and you can modify individual tasks with the easy hard tags. some events can even raise and lower the rooms tension. ya ok that should be fine.


#9

I was also very surprised at this at first but after running a session with it I love it as do my players. It makes the game run so fast and smooth.


#10

You got it.

When the players see you move the Target Number from 12 to 15 as they enter the next room, they know something bad is coming. This creates some great at-the-table tension.

My players haven’t complained about TNs. They just know that when they’re rolling to hit the monsters, rolling to pry that lock, rolling to do whatever, they have a single obvious number they need to meet or beat.


#11

This :point_up_2:.
Thing is, it’s your game. You try it and don’t like it? Just change it. Although I do agree with the above as a perfect example.
If you do haveSome rare loot or something in this room and you really don’t want them to have it unless they roll high you can just say. Minions are 9, room is 12, boss 15, super secret 18.


#12

When actually playing the TN as prescribed in icrpg, the boss of a room can share the same target with the minions and still feel like a boss. That extra heart or two, along with a devastating move set, will accomplish what you feel a graduated target is needed for.

Needless to say, making the boss HARD will do the trick…but there’s no need to. Roleplay your boss as a badass boss. It works.


#13

As all have said, your table, your rules. The TN portion and most of the game is modular. If you wanted to give armor and resistance individually you can.

However…don’t discount effort!!!

Room full of goblins TN 12 room. Timers bringing constant pain. And a door with a lock that is 1 heart to get out and a chest that is 3 hearts to open…

A 3 heart goblin hero comes at the 4th timer. The narrative aspect of the Hero goblin is that it dances away as it gets hit…taking 1/3rd damage…but mechanically its 3 hearts.


#14

Others have made great suggestions about how they use it, but I always find myself playing with this to explore new ways to tell a story. I made a post a little bit ago about variable dual TN for more tactic games. I also like making variable TN based on area for environmental tactics.
I’ve used it more as a storytelling tool most often. In a social situation where my players weren’t welcome they watched the TN rise as they asked prying questions. My players saw the TN increase and could immediately tell the place was feeling more hostile, not combatively, but that people were clamming up and may escalate to violence if made uncomfortable enough.
To me, this is a great way to make the situation in the game tangible and “feel-able” to the players. :slight_smile:


#15

Let me just off-topic (sort of) to comment on how I really loved your post about tactical TNs lol!


#16

I consider that statement canon for ICRPG. I start every thnky sheet with this in mind.

I use it almost every game since the beginning. I have suggested a much more convoluted method to construct room targets, but at the table, on the fly, I do this… 9,12,15… and use EASY and HARD almost every time. I even add them in my notes for ideas the PC’s might try. I create a list of easy tasks, and list of hard tasks. 3-5 entries so I can try to plan ahead of things the players might try (rarely works due to my devilish veteran players!) … Game On!


#17

I’m learning the more I gm that nothing is set in stone. I’ve spent so many hours deliberating things that once we got to the table I ruled in about 10 seconds something better than I planned for 10 days.
Planning definitely helps, like you said with lists of tasks having certain TN and what not. I bet you write them out 5 or 6 times trying to perfect them and eventually you don’t even need the list come game time. You realise you do really want the players to have that epic loot but they roll crap, so you literally move it in front of them until they find it. We’ll, that’s what I do.
I dont really know what I’m going on about really. I’ve gone way off subject I think. Gm brain is too active lol


#18

Plans are worthless, but planning is priceless


#19

My best DM’ing happens when I am totally in the moment and merely responding with what makes sense in that moment in the fiction. It’s a sort of zen or being in the “zone” I continually chase.